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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: #9.


see number 1

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see number 5

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7. Microevolution certainly occurs. Macro has the same mechanisms.



Macro has greater problems. In micro, the EYE is ALREADY intact and is a total operating and functional organ, replete with all the organs it is associated with in harmony with it too, and offers only a slight change in the working mechanism. Macro, assumes the creation of the eye, along with the specialized lens and muscles to adjust the lens, and the iris and the cones and rods and the vitreous fluid, and the special optic nerves, and the brain that can now flip the image right side up and etc, ad nauseum. ALL happening simutaneously. This is science grasping at straws.

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6. Genetics explains how characteristics are passed on.



Yes, but not how they are altered. The vast majority of mutations are not passed on, and the ones that are, are normally only passed on further down the line. The vast majority "revert to type", or become sterile.

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5. Different species in similar environments would evolve to be like each other. Australian animals do this.



Foul! The last sentence is illegal as a proof or piece of evidence as it assumes a conclusion. However, to use the same form of reasoning, Creation explains this better. An intelligence WOULD place differently adapted animals in their own environments, but the cold laws of physics may not necessarily be so accommodating.

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4. Vestigial limbs and organs. Evolution can explain this phenomenon beautifully.



This is a very dogmatic point of view. Sure, if we could see the progression (flow) that should and would exist right now, we could surmise that this was indeed a valid and viable solution to "not having to believe in a creator".



But we do not. So, what is a vestigial limb or organ? One that has no APPARENT use or functionality. Like, um, the tonsils were once considered useless and when a little irritated, doctors removed them by the scores. But ignorance of a fact, does not infer another fact. We now know that they are definitely a factor in our immune system, but many a child had their immune system crippled, before we bothered to look for a use.



We have to remember, an argument from ignorance is NO argument at all. Sorry.

With all due respect...

Mike

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A VERY BRIEF SUMMARY

Some of the evidence for evolution:

1. Simpler fossils in the older rocks, more complex in older, and fossils develop in time order.

2. You would expect major changes in the environment to produce large scale extinctions. Fossil record confirms.

3. All mammals, for example, have the same basic bodily structure [bones and organs] but adapted to their environmental niche. Evolution explains.

4. Vestigial limbs and organs. Evolution can explain this phenomenon beautifully.

5. Different species in similar environments would evolve to be like each other. Australian animals do this.

6. Genetics explains how characteristics are passed on.

7. Microevolution certainly occurs. Macro has the same mechanisms.

8. The same species on different islands would evolve to fit the circumstances on the particular island. Exactly what Darwin found when he studied finches on the Galapagos Islands.

9. The are sequences of fossils that follow on from one another as you would expect. There are even 'links' between one species and another - but not very many see below.

10. Embryos have features that evolution explains well.



{One objection is that there are few 'link' fossils. The answer is that few animals produce fossils and, if speciation is a rapid process then there would be few such transitional animals anyway}



Problems with Creationism

1. Two accounts in Genesis.

2. Contradicts other scientific theories too. For example the moon and sun are made at the same time and before the stars.

3. Does not explain extinctions, vestigial limbs, why all mammals have same bone structure etc.





Summary

Any of the points above might be defended to some extent by Creationists BUT when you consider ALL the above together, an impartial person would have to conclude that the evidence for evolution is overwhelming.

Which is what 99.9% of scientists HAVE concluded and most Christians too -these latter taking Genesis to contain religious not scientific truths. To suggest that all these scientists are wrong/deluded/in Satan's power {ditto the Christians}or whatever is grossly implausible.



Best wishes



Laurie

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: #10 - by Mike - Jul 7, 2003 5:10pm
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:And - by Mike - Jul 7, 2003 5:15pm
Re: You are welcom but.... - by Mike - Jul 8, 2003 2:55pm
Wow! but... - by Laurie [Question... - Jul 8, 2003 3:21pm
Re: Wow! but...you don't know that..... - by Mike - Jul 8, 2003 3:36pm
Re: ...one other thing... - by Mike - Jul 8, 2003 4:02pm
Re: Re: ...here it is, I found it... - by Mike - Jul 8, 2003 4:05pm
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:And - by Julian - Jul 8, 2003 4:42am
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re:And - by Mike - Jul 8, 2003 2:52pm
Answer me this thene. - by Laurie [Question... - Jul 8, 2003 12:08am
Re: Answer me this thene. - by Julian - Jul 8, 2003 4:40am
No Subject - by Laurie [Question... - Jul 8, 2003 10:24am
Re: Biology 101 - by Mike - Jul 8, 2003 2:49pm
Most scientists... - by Laurie [Question... - Jul 8, 2003 3:12pm
Re: Most scientists... - by Mike - Jul 8, 2003 3:33pm
All your reply shows - by Laurie [Question... - Jul 9, 2003 12:03am
Re: My apologies.... - by Mike - Jul 9, 2003 8:11am
No such assumption made. - by Laurie [Question... - Jul 8, 2003 12:04am
Re: No such assumption made. - by Julian - Jul 8, 2003 4:31am
Who do I believe? - by Laurie [Question... - Jul 8, 2003 10:20am
Re: Well,,,,Who do I believe? - by Mike - Jul 8, 2003 2:43pm
Correct but - by Laurie [Question... - Jul 8, 2003 12:01am
Re: Correct but - by Mike - Jul 8, 2003 2:42pm
you have lost me again! - by Laurie [Question... - Jul 8, 2003 3:04pm
Re: Sorry, am trying to keep it simple.... - by Mike - Jul 8, 2003 3:10pm
A good point - by Laurie [Question... - Jul 7, 2003 11:59pm
Re: Not an argument from ignorance - by Mike - Jul 8, 2003 2:37pm
not an explanation .. - by Laurie [Question... - Jul 8, 2003 3:07pm
Re: not an explanation .. - by Mike - Jul 10, 2003 8:49am
Re: #1 - by Mike - Jul 7, 2003 4:45pm
Re: Re: #2 - by Mike - Jul 7, 2003 4:47pm
Re: Re: Re: #3 - by Mike - Jul 7, 2003 4:50pm
Re: I just do not follow this point - by Mike - Jul 8, 2003 2:33pm
Still don't get it. - by Laurie [Question... - Jul 8, 2003 2:57pm
You do not understand - by Laurie [Question... - Jul 7, 2003 11:51pm
Re: You do not understand - by Mike - Jul 8, 2003 2:26pm
Look forward to that [nt] - by Laurie [Question... - Jul 8, 2003 2:53pm
Nonsense I'm afraid - by Laurie [Question... - Jul 7, 2003 11:47pm
Re: Nonsense I'm afraid - by Mike - Jul 8, 2003 2:17pm
Sorry misprint - by Laurie [Question... - Jul 8, 2003 2:52pm
Re: Ok - by Mike - Jul 8, 2003 2:59pm
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